BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

Hope this went ok. It's 1pm and I just found out about this protest.

Yeah, just saw it as well.

Do we know if it is, in fact, private property?

County Real Estate website says so...

Repost from other thread

Map Link

hi every one,

i just found out about this about 3:30 this afternoon! our bike trail is being held hostage by "your casino, pittsburgh." why can't they just mark a bike route lane. i spoke with several of my canadian geese friends along the way, and urged them to christen the walk way as only they can.

ducky and cheeks dad

Let's put the bike trail on the other side of the Allegheny,since the casino doesn't want us riding past their "pristine property.It could go from Station Square to Neville Island which would give us a safe way to get on the Montour Trail to Groveton.

I'll bet that once the casino really gets going, there's going to be more wrestling on that trail than on the jail trail.

how did this go? didn't know about it until too late.

was the trail blocked today?

One of our contacts in DPW is going to show up to the casino tomorrow morning with the MOU in hand that states the casino will allow people to bicycle on their property. We'll keep all of you posted.

Just because I don't think you guys (Bike-PGH) hear it enough, YOU ROCK!!

Thanks for your passion and effort in promoting and protecting all things cycling.

Cool, there's a MOU and they still put up those signs? Yet one more reason to hate on the casino.

My fear: They'll look at the MOU and say they *are* complying with it, but bikes just gotta be walked. When I was a kid, that was akin to making a promise with your fingers crossed behind your back.

Yeah.. im not sure what they will consider the legal definition of cyclist or cycling. IMO, getting off your bike and walking it just makes you a pedestrian with a bike. Not a cyclist and its not cycling.

Officially representing the under-informed, I must ask what is an "MOU"?

I saw people stop and walk their bikes yesterday afternoon, but I also saw people ride on past without anyone saying anything. The riverwalk was pretty crowded, especially after the baseball game. This morning it is just cyclists and runners.

MOU=Memorandum Of Understanding. Scott, care to elaborate on the specifics?

Below is email from the Three Rivers Heritage Trail yahoo group:

I agree with Mary Shaw's suggestion that we all contact the Mayor's office via email / web / phone and make our position very clear: the bike trail must be open to bicycles past the casino! Everyone please send a message!

Paul

Update:

Looks like we can bike again.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09222/989915-100.stm

There should be a Twitter hashtag for this

"Rivers Casino spokesman Dan Fee said the wording on the sign was always viewed as temporary. "It would have helped if the biking community called us to see what the facts were before they started alerting the media," he said."

We did call them! And they told us it was private property. There was never any indication that the sign was 'temporary.'

While we're at it, are the shower facilities and bicycle parking specified in the plan available?

I'm happy "access" is reopened, but I suspect that had the bike community not made such a stink and had the backing of ravenstahl, onorato, & the city's bike/ped coordinator that we'd be walking our bikes for months and years to come.

I'm worried about this wording from the article netviln posted:

"Legislation passed by Pittsburgh City Council and signed by Mayor Luke Ravenstahl in May governing the land in front of the casino guaranteed that the trail would be open as "a public pedestrian walkway and bike path" for as long as they city wanted it to be used as such, except when it has to be closed for construction, improvements, maintenance, emergencies, or when the casino feels use of the trail "may adversely affect safety or security of the public."

The casino could easily pull the public safety card in the future to again block access to the trail.

Cool!

I'll count it as a victory. Since we're not going to get a trail completely separate from pedestrian traffic, you're more than likely going to have to get off and walk when the area is crowded with people, signs or no signs. I don't see it as any different from St. Square, Washington's Landing, etc. in that regard.

The fact is Dan Fee, your employer sucks to have as a neighbor.

http://legistar.city.pittsburgh.pa.us/detailreport/?key=11652

The Easement Agreement:

"Section 3. a) Holdings may restrict access to all or any part of the Riverfront Promenade for limited periods of time in connection with any of the following: (i) construction; (ii) improvements, maintenance, or repairs on, in, or to the Property or the Riverfront Promenade; and/or (iii) any emergency situation that Holdings, in its best good faith sole discretion, believes may adversely affect safety or security of the public on the Property or the Riverfront Promenade.

b) Holdings may periodically stop traffic along the Riverfront Promenade in order to allow casino guests to cross to and from the casino to the amphitheater, under the following conditions: Holdings shall use commercially reasonable efforts to manage traffic flow, in an effort to prevent traffic either east or west of the Riverfront Promenade from backing up, except for periods of short duration long enough to effectuate the crossing of the casino guests across the Riverfront Promenade.

c) Public access to the Riverfront Promenade will be subject to reasonable policies and restrictions imposed by Holdings in order to maintain public decorum, safety, and security (such as the removal of loiterers or squatters, a prohibition on solicitation, and the ejection of anyone causing a disturbance or potential or actual harm to other persons or property).

d) Any access restrictions pursuant to Paragraph 3(a)-(c) shall not count towards a termination of the City’s Easement Agreement pursuant to Paragraph 2. "

However, the bigger problem I see with this easement agreement is that the city sold "Exhibit A" to the casino and in return received "Exhibit B." Whereas, the city owned the property at the river's edge, but that's where the stage of the casino's amphitheatre is. So the casino revised the alignment of the trail to fit with their design scheme.

Unfortunately, this new location of the trail separates the casino from the amphitheatre. This is a traffic easement ripe for conflict.

erok and i were just out there (he's writing a blog post about this minute) and we saw them carting away the signs in a little red maintenance vehicle. i'm glad to see that we've at least won this battle, but we're going to have to be vigilant for a while (are they going to put the signs back up on the weekends, during concerts, etc..)

As for Dan Fee... Give me a break. It's not like these great new "neighbors" reached out to the community to tell us that they were planning on doing this. The casino... such victims.

I understand the argument that they were having an event, and having signage for such an event imo is perfectly reasonable. If you are having a big function and put up signs saying something like "event in progress, please walk your bikes" that is completely different and I would gladly abide by that.

removing the signs

http://bike-pgh.org/2009/08/10/near-mutiny-averted-at-new-rivers-casino-over-north-shore-trail-access/

One thing, it seems that Mr Fee is doing a lot of backpedaling (cycle humor). Saying we should have contacted him instead of the media,etc. Has anyone contact Rich Lord to give their side? That the casino was contacted multiple times?, etc?

serious. people posted their conversations with the casino on this thread. they basically told us to STFU!

yep, rich lord called me while i was out with erok. called him back, but just left a msg.

Business men will do their business as well as regulatations let them.

Does a casino have any kind of productive business?

Profit on the suffering of the poor? Middle men for the corruption of politicians? Perhaps, on the more optimistic side, romanticizing the acquisition of unearned wealth?

I don't think we should ever expect much from them as far as good will goes.

Mick

i love that picture so much!

yeah, we couldn't have timed it better. as soon as we rolled up, that thing turned right in front of us, and we were like..."WHAT!! No way!" so i grabbed my camera

when i look at that picture i imagine that "whah whah whah whaaaaaaaaaah" noise and it makes me laugh.

so are we going to bike to gamble yet or what. maybe if a large # of cyclists who are parking there and carryiing helmets into the place, etc, will convince them we are good money spending money winning people.

also out of curiosity, i wonder how the LCD billboards they agreed not to have are affecting views of the stars from the science center's rooftop observatory telescope (i worked there during all the casino talks...)

also i hope you guys realize i am half kidding about the gambling. but i still havent been in a casino and wouldnt mind biking to my first penny slots experience.

I keep waffling between going in out of curiosity and seeing if any of the food is worthwhile or just avoiding the place, even though

I can see the billboard from my workspace. I am thinking about putting something on that part of the window to block seeing it.

@caitlin: Also note that every tree along the trail has not one but two upward-pointed lights. Stupid, stupid, stupid, from an astronomer's perspective. Of course, practically every outdoor light between the West End Bridge and the Sixth Street Bridge is astronomer-unfriendly; it's a wonder the observatory could see anything at all before the casino was built. This cannot help.

Also, FWIW, I made my views known to Port Authority, loud and clear, that their Allegheny Ave "T" station better darn well have astronomer-friendly lighting. They did pretty well with station lighting along the 2004-rebuilt "T" line, so keep your fingers crossed. (That dirt pile across the street from the casino is the "T".)

Caitlin - I'll gladly partake in a penny slots ride. We should make everyone start with some predetermined amount of pennies, like 4 rolls or something, and call it a day when it's gone.

I strolled through casinos in Vegas. Those playing the slots were seriously undead.

Like their souls had just walked away from them. Desolate.

Sure, take your pennies some time, but a better intro would be to just observe and not play their game for them.

After all, the worst thing that could happen is that you might win.

Mick

No worries Mick, I've been to Vegas on about ten separate occasions due to work duties and travel as a kid and I believe my total gambling expenditures are less than $20.

You are correct, it is a city of zombies. Worse than Monroeville Mall even. A horrid place indeed.

i assume they have penny slots... maybe i should call i also like the idea of a predetermined amount of pennies to start with.

Do the slots spit out coins or vouchers? If the latter, it could be a stop on an alleycat or scavenger hunt.

They have penny slots. And 2cent ones. And at least one $500 per pull machine if you're feeling rich. And stupid.

the alleycat idea is a hilarious one. i think i will mention it to ndanger.