BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

So what does "vintage" mean in the world of bicycles (like, how old does something have to be to be vintage)?

seems to me freeride is enough of an old bikes museum

you dont know what a bike museum is till you go to bikeheaven,,,,,they have bikes that are so rare any state is lucky to have one,,,stop by to see many lol

I'm hoping I'm wrong, and I'd be pleased to be corrected. -but-

Is this actually a museum, or is it more of a warehouse for the owner's online vintage bike sales business? (link)

Because that's what it is, I think - but I'd be happy to be wrong.

The vintage bikes there are for sale, right? The vintage parts you donate are used for -- what, exactly?

I'm sorry to be blunt/dense, but is this a museum or a showroom?

If I've got this wrong, please set me straight.

Vannevar,,thanks for the post,,i can set you stright,,my name is Craig Morrow,,i own Bicycleheaven,,Bicycleheaven is a Bike shop Museum,its a Bike shop,,has a Museum,,its in a Warehouse and i own the Bikes,in the Bike shop i have sales of Vintage Bikes and parts and new Bikes and parts,,it is a Business.Some of the Bikes are for Sale,the Bikes and Parts you Donate go in the Museum and / some parts may be for sale to run the Museum that is free to everyone who comes to Bicycleheaven,,and yes the Museum has a show room,,i have spent over 4 months of my time from 8 till 12 night and paid people to make this happen,,with some help for free from some Dam good Friends,,,,i never made a dime on this to date,,its been a lose,,the Museum that is,,,i Love Bikes and i have many,,to date since i have opend the Museum i only have been given two free Bikes the rest i paid for,,,i have paid for with my own money,it seems you think something is wrong with this,,please see me to talk about this so i can set you stright,,UP DATE,,THAT LINK YOU POSTED IS MY BIKE SHOP EBAY AUCTION SITE THAT HAS BEEN USED FOR OVER 10 YEARS NOTHING TO DO WITH BICYCLEHEAVEN THE MUSEUM,,THE MUSEUM HAS BEEN OPEN FOR A FEW MONTHS ONLY IF THAT,,

Hello Mr. Morrow, thanks for a timely and earnest response. I will def. stop by and introduce myself, I've been meaning to come over. I've heard it's an interesting place.

FWIW, it is a business (as you say), it's a sales showroom, it's a cool store to walk around in - but I don't see how it's a museum. Is Kraynick's a museum, too?

My local bike shop has several floors of bikes - folders, 'bents, racers, road, MTB, and quite a few older/legacy bikes up on the wall for display/ambiance. They also let me come in and look around for free.

I've read (Post-Gazette, etc) that your business is buying bikes low - at garage sales, Salvation Army, etc - and selling them high to Boomer$ chasing the bikes they once owned..

I think your store is probably great for bicycling in Pgh. I hope your business thrives, I really do.

But it's difficult to swallow your original post soliciting vintage bikes for the "Museum", which you'll then sell at profit.

I look forward to meeting you and saying Hello. Cheers, V.

AGAIN its a Bike shop and a Museum,i have a Bike Shop and i have a Museum,i know when most come to my MUSEUM they know that is what it is a Bicycle Museum and i have a Store to boot with no complaints.The Bikes and parts in my Museum that many will tell you are not for sale and they are for the Museum and what i do with them is up to me not you my dear friend.You say your local bike shop lets you walk around for free as well and thats just great but i dont think the bikes they have are from 1862 vintage bikes so maybe you just dont know what a Museum is.My Bike shop like many like Kraynicks i would think is to make Money Daa - my Museum is for free to all that come for the young the old and for people like you so undestand no cost its all free,i pay for the heat the elt bill and the Rent from the money i make from my bicycle store.I have been told by everyone this is just what Pittsburgh needed and they love it.Till you your the only bent spoke so far ,as for Kraynicks is it a Bike Museum ask him not me

I love Kraynick's shop! He has helped me find some great parts for the vintage bikes that I've rescued from various places. Plus, he fixes and donates bikes to kids for the holidays!

Too bad you outbid me on the loop bicycle frame on ebay, Craig, and posted it immediately for twice as much. I was hoping to build that bike on my own. Guess I'll just have to settle for restoring the Schwinn hornet that Jerry sold me for $20.

I hope your museum shop promotes cycling in the area. It seems a shame that those bikes languished in storage for so long. They should be ridden, enjoyed and cherished. Go ahead and sell them, but asking for donated bikes does sound a bit hinky.

I Love Kraynicks the same and know him very well and we both help each other find bikes and parts and i Donate bikes as well for over 25 years and helped kids build bikes for years.Im so very sorry i out bid you on a ebay auction but thats what it is a auction,like Kraynicks we are in Bussiness,,i dont think you get it i dont sell many Bikes i keep them and show them thats why i have over 2000 Bikes lol,,if you dont think a Bike Museum promotes cycling then i dont know what does,,my Museum has been in the news all over the usa and pittsburgh is in every story,,,you dont have to donate anything to me as i bought 99.9% off my bikes some from bike shops like Krynicks and many others and belive me they all made a few backs to boot,,thats business,,,,

Are you buying these bikes or are they donations?

"i bought 99.9% off my bikes some from bike shops like Krynicks and many others"

"to date since i have opend the Museum i only have been given two free Bikes the rest i paid for"

read the thread

When you go to the Carnegie, everything there is, theoretically for sale. "We" just arent in that realm. The Carnegie periodically sells pieces from it's holdings to make new acquisitions or otherwise support the pieces that best suit the descriptive parameters of it's collection. It is a museum because someone uses a descriptive set of guidelines to determine what goes on display, and that the collection has some kind of continuity. And sometimes people donate stuff. And they have a gift shop. The Warhol sells the crap out of things.

Bicycle Heaven definitely has a theme to it's collection, and there is definitely "museum" quality stuff there that people now have a chance to see. It's not like the guy is advertising a "Museum of New Trek Bikes". I don't see an issue.

I was there yesterday for about a half hour. I did not see a price tag on one bike. No salesperson walked up to me and asked if I was interested or needed anything. If you like old bikes it's worth going to go take a look around. This place is very big and they have a lot of bike.

I have met Craig (bicycle heaven) a few times now at the store/museum since it opened and he seems like a good enough guy. His collection of bikes is very awe inspiring if somewhat limited in scope (lots of Schwinns). The first floor has many bikes that I would definitely classify as “museum” quality bikes with the upstairs’ rooms full of nice old bikes, but probably better classified as vintage rather than rare- YMMV. Since he is nice enough to display his stuff for free, I’ll give him a little slack on internet manners (the all cap thing) and some of the other bumps in the road that come with starting a business. I recommend stopping by and saying hello.

When you go to the Carnegie, everything there is, theoretically for sale.

I'm not sure that's correct. For a museum, selling part of their collection is a big deal, and there are ethical limits on what they're supposed to sell (i.e. duplicate works, or works they can't care for properly) and on what they can do with the money (can't use it for operating expenses). See this WSJ article for instance.

If the Carnegie decided it was willing to sell arbitrary pieces to anyone with cash, I expect it would get lots of bad press and lose donors and funding. They're supposed to chose what pieces they can do without based on artistic considerations, not based on how much a private collector is willing to pay for their Matisse.

Any museum has to be careful not to turn into a mere antiques store. It sounds like so far Bicycle Heaven is doing fine in that regard.

A museum can do what it wants. It mostly comes down to whether it's a publicly or privately funded museum as to what ethical responsibilities they have. Generally, donated/found pieces (a good chunk of a museum's collection) is usually never sold, whereas purchased pieces can (and often are) sold, but usually only to acquire/make room for other pieces.

The thing is... Most museums usually only sale to other museums, but value on pieces in museums is usually so high that's it's done on trade/loan/barter for land these days. This is usually done extremely privately.

Because of this "stigma" of sale... Some museums now have TWO large galleries. One for the permanent collection, and one (often rented) gallery for sales of works. That said, if you wanted a Matisse though, you better get to know the folks in charge of the collection. And have a very high balance in your account. And awesome credentials as a collector (yes, this is a thing). If you want one, you can, in theory, get one. You can even rent pieces. BUT... As I stated above, this is usually reserved as privileges for other museums these days. That's more of a conservation thing than an ethics thing, because museums are businesses too. With HUGE operating costs.

Bicycle has a two-room model in place. Awesome! That means you can see history and potentially purchase some piece of it to start your collection. Or you can look at it as a gift shop. Basically if he's willing to give a bit of history on the bikes he has and keeps the place in good, clean order that's all that most people expect of a museum these days.