Cyclist attacked on East Liberty Blvd–Memorial Day weekend

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mark
Participant
#

maybe that should be a new thread. this one is a disaster. while we are talking about race relations though i don’t know that “take back the night” is the most appropriate name for this ride… kind of antagonistic… to be “taking back” streets means that:

1. we don’t have control of them

2. we can control them

3. we want control of them

4. other people have the control that we seek, implying that we are against these people

the idea of “whose streets” “our streets” ringing out on ELB at 9pm is a scary one to me, not that i think that would happen but still… its an intense name for something that should be much more of a reach into the community.

i feel like “safe streets ride” or something witty someone else thinks up is better.


erok
Keymaster
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i thought the same thing


eMcK
Participant
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Mark, I thought the same thing myself, but your reply is much better than the 2 or 3 I wrote and erased.

I don’t want to take anything back, I just don’t want to get beat down without provocation.

Does it need a name? Maybe it is just a ride, one of many in the upcoming months in many of the neighborhoods in Pgh, a different one every week.


Pierce
Participant
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Good point Mark. I don’t even consider them “my streets.” I’m riding through somebody else’s neighborhood. I just don’t want to be targeted by people because of a morally irrelevant characteristic like riding a bike.


saltm513
Participant
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…woah.

Greetings from the ignorant poster. I certainly didn’t mean to stir such harm (or conversation for that matter) with my exceptionally poor choice of words. Indeed, I had no clue of its weighted racial connotation. I do hope we can soon rest this discussion (it sure would help me sleep tonight), but having been the (unintentional) instigator of the direction that this thread has veered and steered, I’ll have no peace unless I first apologize and clarify. Had I known that this was such a loaded term, I never would have chosen it. Indeed it is my serious bad, for which I am sorry. Even without the knowledge of what racial weight these words held, I quickly regretted having said them, as I love the kids of this neighborhood and am both involved and invested in my community. At the time I simply happened to be really heated by this occurrence as this is my neighborhood and Justin is a friend of mine. I was quite alarmed to hear of his ordeal and pain. Still, I definitely didn’t know the weight of this word, and whether you choose to believe me or not, I more so meant for it to infer something lighter, along the lines of “meddling kids”. And just that: kids. Not black kids or white kids (as those who’ve jumped in front of my path have not belonged to one specific race, or gender for that matter). I do now realize this was an incredibly poor choice of words on my part, and want to apologize for any offense or grief that I have caused to members, writers and readers alike. I hope you can all forgive me. I would like to request, however, that in offering attention to such matters, correction through education often proves more constructive than quick assumption. There is also a level of miscommunication that is experienced over the internet, texts, forums, or whatever other methods of communications that limit the interpersonal. Unfortunately, it also simply happens to be far more prominent, permanent and unforgiving.

All that to affirm that yes, we’re all human… And we’re all animals (guilty). My apologies for having responded to this situation so quickly from of my flesh. I’d much appreciate an extension of your grace. I’m reminded in plentiful areas of my life that I need it daily, and am sure I’ll probably need it on here from time to time as well.

But yes, back to the ride, whatever it is called, if anything. I would indeed myself like to go. And as for scraper bikes and vinyl, two of my friends are vinyl distributors, and I get some of their scraps every now and then for art/hoops, etc.. I am sure they’d be into donating some to scraper bikes, and I am happy to ask them. I’d be super stoked about such a project. Community engagement is indeed a passion of mine. It is part of why I ride.


dannyp
Participant
#

Thumbs down to (at least) Nicholas and ndromb for their poor reading comprehension: I didn’t call anyone racist at any point in this thread, so chill the fuck out instead of getting mad at me for doing something I didn’t do. And of course, I’m not being critical of cyclists speaking up for cyclists. I do believe that saltm used a racial slur and have no reason to not believe him or her when he or she says that it was out of ignorance and not the intent to use a racist term.

That being said I am surprised by people are so shocked that this is a term that hurts the way that any racial slur does and that it really doesn’t have a common usage (when applied to humans) that isn’t a racial slur. When it’s applied to dogs, it means the dog is of an unwanted/indeterminate/mixed breed, and it carries a negative connotation. Why do people think it means something radically different when it’s applied to humans? I guess there’s a significant number of people who have used this term without thinking about it, which honestly to me is just a little amazing.

I wouldn’t have been cool with someone saying that kids in e.liberty are like unwanted dogs.

I think people (Pierce, etc.) need to put their thoughts about animals aside and realize that people of color (and women and many other groups) have been dehumanized repeatedly by being compared to various types of animals: being called apes, savages, dogs, etc. Not wanting that to continue is not specism, it’s anti-racism.


Nick D
Participant
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dannyp, I apologize for misinterpreting your words.

However, you did say “shame” on us/them for saying such a racially charged word and tolerating such racial radicalism.


quizbot
Participant
#

Wow.


rachel_ding
Participant
#

saltm513: That was a really, really heartfelt message. It’s hard to be accused of doing something wrong when you intended no harm at all, and I hope you don’t lose any sleep tonight! :-)

ndromb and saltm513: I like the idea of kids and anyone else decorating bikes with vinyl! That WOULD be a good BikeFest event. The wheels in my mind are turning… I also have a friend who is a vinyl-maker, and he has scraps too. Glitter-paint, paint markers, vinyl – yes please!


Nick D
Participant
#

Also, dannyp, unless you are set on anonymity, I think the whole board would benefit from you introducing yourself here.

I think we all had a hard time with someone new and anonymous coming on and posting such strong opinions and shaming us.


jakeliefer
Participant
#

So uhhhh… how was Council To Go?


joeframbach
Participant
#

Wow, indeed.


joeframbach
Participant
#

Wow, indeed. dannyp, you’re also welcome to introduce yourself here.


BradQ
Participant
#

This thread epitomizes just about every reason why I walked away from lefty organizing and never looked back.


Kramhorse
Participant
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This thread epitomizes just about every reason why I walked away from lefty organizing and never looked back.

+1


dannyp
Participant
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And I think that response indicates every reason why you haven’t been missed by anyone I know, BradQ.


BradQ
Participant
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Cool dude, good to know.

Anything else to add?


eMcK
Participant
#

Sweet, the personal attacks have started! I may be wrong, but I think this the first instance on this board. It’s been a good run folks.


joeframbach
Participant
#

I think Godwin’s Law has yet to be invoked. A good run.


bikeygirl
Participant
#

Wow…. good intentions ran amuck, it seems…

Everyone relax….. go ride your bike!

:)


dwillen
Participant
#

Ahh, the joys of anonymous Internet flaming.

dannyp, we are a friendly bunch around here. Nobody goes around posting personal insults at other people on this board. Can we tone it down just a bit? You will get a better response if you try to keep the conversation on a friendly, constructive level.


edmonds59
Participant
#

Quite uncool, especially in view of the original topic. really. chill.


roo
Participant
#

I am new to this board too, and I signed on because of this thread. I don’t know why you need to know dannyp to take his comments seriously. That being said, I know dannyp, and he is one of the most articulate people I know on the subject of oppression.

I think it is important to take a day or two (maybe a month of reading some books) before responding when someone calls you out on your privilege. It hurts. And this pain can prevent a person from truly hearing. I am a white person, and I feel so appreciated when people call me out because it means that they care about my growth. Danny expressed his concerns about what people have been saying, and I really appreciate him for that. When I read this discussion board, I feel disheartened about the ability of the people around me to grow. I think there is a lot of what some might call “backlash” happening above.

I don’t expect my comment to mean anything today. I just have this hope that someday in the future when one of you is getting called out, that you take a breath, and trust that the people who are calling you out are not trying to be assholes. And maybe instead of reacting, you could perhaps have a meaningful discussion about race or class or gender.

I think all forums are acceptable for deconstructing oppression.


mark
Participant
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edmonds59
Participant
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And just in case it wasn’t clear, my comment just above was not directed at any individual, that was global.

I am wide open for discussions of race, class, and gender, areas with huge room for improvement in our society. And areas in which my own personal passion, biking, provides significant opportunities for building bridges. But not if we burn the bridges in our own house.

Welcome, roo.


eMcK
Participant
#

Oh I get it. We are being punk’d right? Where’s that rascal Ashton Kutcher?


mark
Participant
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so hows justin? it seems like today might be the day he wakes up not feeling too bad, maybe even thinking about when the next time he’ll be on a bike is.


justinc
Participant
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+1thanks brad.

I was starting to feel like I had to have been killed to win that persons concern. Though I’m sure even that would be made less important somehow.


justinc
Participant
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Oh and Justin is ok.

I’m on vicodin and icing my collarbone often.

It still hurts to do everything and I don’t have more than 4 fingers free to do things. Mornings Are the worst, pain wise. I’m also very bored.

I want to figure out a way to still be involved on the ms150 ride next weekend. I was supposed to ride it.


BradQ
Participant
#

So what’s the verdict on how you’re feeling? Like Mark said, you might be starting to feel great about now, or things you didn’t even know were sore may have started popping up. I’ve had it go either way after major crashes.

**Beat me to it**

Good to hear things are looking up for you! Who knows what may come out of this. Ten years ago I broke my wrist being stupid on my bicycle just as summer was heating up. I picked up a camera seriously for the first time and have been shooting ever since.


mark
Participant
#

when i got hit (although not nearly the same) day 6 was the day that I woke up and didn’t immediately feel like dying. although its a little late for this i kept a journal about how i was feeling a couple times a day (and then a couple times a week, and then once a month for a full year), reading it now makes me feel really grateful about how little pain i still have from that accident… might be worth doing.

as far as being bored goes I learned PHP in my first 3 weeks… between computer, TV, and reading i can’t really say i did a whole lot else though


Shred303
Participant
#

‘cburch: misplaced but justifiable rage’ Seriously man? This is a joke to them. This is just their idea of good fun. A great way to add a little excitement up an otherwise boring evening. If this was a red neck in a pickup truck running you off the road or throwing beer cans at your head you would be absolutely indignant but since these are poor inner city down trodden youth you relate and sympathize with there ‘rage’. Whatever man. I have no pity or sympathy for them, their actions are absolutely despicable. These are probably of the same group of cretins that looted the Sunoco right down the street when the power went out two summers ago. @#%# them.


rachel_ding
Participant
#

Shred303: Ok, that was not what I wanted to read.


Shred303
Participant
#

edmonds59
Participant
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O.k., shred, so what do you think we ought to do? Shoot em’ in the street, kill ’em? Or just throw ’em in prison. Wait, that’s what we do now, and how’s that working out? If they’re black male urban teenagers, they stand a pretty good chance of ending up with one of those results no matter what they do. And that’s why they don’t give a shit.

So if you ever throw a beer can at me from your pickup truck, I guarantee I will be indignant.

While you’re at it, check out the origin of the term redneck, it’s not what you think. Blair Mountain, WV. I’d actually be proud to be a redneck.


Shred303
Participant
#

Hey look I live in the area, have dear friends that live just a few blocks from the incident and ride my bike through the vicinity quite frequently.

I think cburchs bicycle based youth outreach is a great idea. I just don’t think the perpetrators deserve any sympathy. Defending myself is also a consideration but there’s little you can do when you are alone and blindsided on bicycle.

BTW I don’t drive a pickup or drink beer from a can and yes the original red necks have plenty to be proud of.


quizbot
Participant
#

@edmonds59 I have to respectfully disagree. If you’re assaulting innocent people & sending them to the hospital with severe injuries, you need to be locked up. Doesn’t matter if you’re white, black, green, or purple…. there’s no excuse for the behavior. There may be underlying reasons for it in this case, but certainly no excuse.


Pierce
Participant
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I would also like to add that there are also a lot of decentcool kids that are in similarly shitty situations, but deal with it in different ways. There might be a couple of assholes, but doesn’t mean the entire neighborhood is like that.


edmonds59
Participant
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Of course something has to be done. The police need to do their jobs and find these people, stop them from hurting others, and the legal system needs to assign punishment appropriate to the crime. But there is an enormous abyss between that and #%*#% them.


quizbot
Participant
#

One on one, the kids around here seem to be 99% cool. Put them in a pack though, even worse with maybe a little bit of alcohol… on the later side of night the tone definitely changes. I have tried to engage some of these kids over the last 10 years… crossing the bridge is very difficult, if not impossible. It’s really very sad.

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