How do we get a mirror on the chute?
…putting some sharrows on the inbound lane of 2nd ave would reduce inbound traffic in the chute?
Also making 2nd Avenue two lanes instead of three would make the backup longer in distance – but likely would not change the wait time, unless outbound traffic backed up all the way to the HMB.
Is there that much traffic at rush hour? Anyone know?
I’ve had occasion to continue in on 2nd, at the end of the day. Traffic does pile up a bit at the HMB. My impression of the the outbound traffic is that it doesn’t seem to back up much beyond Swinburne.
So this sounds a bit counter-intuitive but I’d have to say that 2nd might be able to go on a diet. But I’ve never explicitly paid attention to it. So please correct me.
Why is there money to refurb Craig/Baum while people like us have to wrack our brains trying to rethink this intersection? Aren’t there professionals who do this?
someone in city hall said to me yesterday that the Swinburne bridge was also on the list for replacement next year. anybody know about that? aside from totally isolating greenfield it might be the chance to put some order into the chaos.
If that bridge is up for replacement then this is the time to demand a bike-able ramp from the EFT parking lot (and ramp back down the other way along the hillside into junction hollow) and stop dealing with the chute.
Am I also remembering that Almono said they’re going to connect between the east end of the parking lot, toward their bike/ped infrastructure? The more connects the better.
It’s way past that time. Back when it was time, we did raise the issue. But it went nowhere.
@neilmd I would be surprised if Swinburne bridge would be replaced in the near future, especially with the Greenfield Bridge coming down. They just repaved Swinburne, likely in anticipation of the clusterfuck that is going to occur when they demo Greenfield Bridge.
I think the upshot of this whole thread is that we cyclists are sick of the status quo chute, it doesn’t handle the traffic now let alone any more, so City Hall needs to hear us loudly, often, soon, and from several individuals and groups.
More pointedly, we ned more than one solution. “Well, Almono said they would address that” is not an acceptable answer. At least it is not a complete answer. And I don’t think it’s an answer at all, since it’s outside their immediate bailiwick.
ALMONO project may actually route a lot of traffic off of irwin street after their grand boulevard is complete.
If that is the case, there may be a case for closing one lane adjacent to the sidewalk since there may be less need for the extra throughput.
This would likely be several years down the pipe though, and also after the greenfield bridge is rebuilt.
Also, other opportunities could arise if the city gets funding for a transit connection via panther hollow as well. http://www.post-gazette.com/news/transportation/2015/08/29/Pittsburgh-seeking-money-to-build-transit-link-between-Oakland-Almono-site/stories/201508290058
someone in city hall said to me yesterday that the Swinburne bridge was also on the list for replacement next year. anybody know about that?
it’s in the 2016 capital budget proposal, as is replacement of the Anderson Bridge which carries Blvd of the Allies over the Hollow, but as a future-year proposal to start planning for work to begin in a further-future year.
(That is, as far as i can tell, the 2016 budget proposes to in 2017 start work to replace the Swinburne/Frazier Bridge in 2018, or maybe later. See also the budget-proposal thread, where I may have been a bit more coherent….)
I see byogman was talking about the Swinburne bridge, not the Greenfield bridge. Sorry.
Does anyone have actual numbers of the amount of bike and pedestrian traffic in the chute during peak times?
My personal experience is it is not a crowded venue. I may try to get over there next week and do some counts. I can do them similar to the traffic counts done by the city a few weeks ago.
Any suggestions on how to count traffic also? I thought I would count numbers inside and outside the chute, whether people walk their bikes or not, and maybe note if car traffic is backed up even with the chute and for how long. Anything else?
I really feel for this to be a legitimate concerned discussion, we need real numbers rather than just saying it is too crowded or unsafe.
As I stated earlier, I did get a chance to count bikes through this area today- 7-9:00 am and 4-6:00 pm using similar format to the city counting process from a few weeks ago. Yes, that was me sitting on top of the wall on the south side of 2nd avenue today. I think I got a weeks or more worth of fumes and particulates even though I was elevated and it was breezy.
I will compile data in the next day or two, but may not get a chance to do so until early next week. Stay tuned…………..
I found a mirrored hubcap on the way to the West End and stuck it up. Well see if it lasts.
The tape is to hold in place until the glue sets.
It was there yesterday afternoon. By the way (and for reference), I was just notified that my request (earlier in this thread, for reference 25015) had been forwarded to the traffic engineering department.
Which probably means nothing in terms of it getting done and just means they’re so backlogged it take THAT long to get 10s of attention to delegate, but who knows, and FYI in case we’d all like to pile on the same things directly for tracking purposes.
Haven’t been through the chute since the DIY mirror install. Does it work?
i don’t think so, no. IMO it’s way too small–i think i only saw it because i was looking for it, and trying to focus on it was actually more difficult than to just slow down and look around the corner.
I did count traffic in or next to the Chute on October 15- it was in the low 50’s, overcast, windy, and spit a little rain in the afternoon. Count times were 7-9am and 4-6pm.
Am- total inbound (towards town) was 51 bikes, with 21 using the chute and 30 using the road. Also during this time there were 14 bikes going outbound- with 11 using the chute and 3 in the road.
PM – total outbound was 72 bikes, with 70 in the chute and only 2 using the road. Inbound there were 22 bikes total- 15 in chute, with only 7 in the road.
You can draw whatever conclusions you like from this – my observation was that totals coming inbound, it was pretty much a toss up with 36 in the chute, and 33 in the road. Outbound however, 81 were in the chute opposed to 5 in the road. Clearly the chute gets most of the traffic total.
Interestingly, although I saw a few (5 or 6?) people virtually stop before entering the chute at either end, I only was aware of 5 people that gave any sort of signal (bell, whistle, shout) while approaching the ends of the chute.
The few times I have encountered another bike in the chute or on the sidewalk past the chute outbound, it was always possible for us both to ride past each other with exercising caution, meaning slowing down and riding straight. If you cannot do either of these, stopping until the opposing bike passes will only take a few seconds.
Sure it would be great to make the chute 3 feet wider, have mirrors at both ends, and for everyone to make some sound before slowly taking a 90 degree blind turn. But until then at least my expectation is the same as I have of a car trying to pass me with adequate clearance- slow down and only go when you have enough space to do so safely.
I can send anyone the full document broken down by 30 minute segments, including identification by age, sex, and helmet use if you PM me. The info has been sent to the City bike/ped coordinator. There were a few pedestrians, but only 11 in the am, and 29 in the pm, mostly from cross country teams. All but one were in the chute- one person did pass inbound in the am on the sidewalk on the south side of the street.
Thanks helen s. That is quite a bit of traffic. I haven’t had a problem in the chute yet. I ride it outbound only. Enjoy.
I noticed the little mirrored thing yesterday. Too small to be of value if you’re going with any speed.
Me, I’m a chute man, both directions. I tried the road but didn’t feel safe. Speeding vehicles around two pinch points. Then trying to go fast with them, signal that I’m turning, turn, and drop into a lower gear just wasn’t fun. I tried it on a HealthyRide and so far, that’s the only hill I’ve had to walk up because I got stuck in 6 or 5 trying to go from sprint to climb.
I always slow at the turns along the chute route to a crawl, and ring a bell many times. I have had a dozen close encounters, and almost always the people going the other way are not doing anything to announce their presence. I did like the one guy who bellowed “Wow! Corner!” several times.
One little thing that could make a big difference:
Going from the Greenfield Ave chute section to the 2nd Ave section, the chute goes from being sidewalk to being half-sidewalk, half-road. This narrows the effective width of the bikeable chute even more that it is already.
Therefore, perhaps the lower, street-part can be filled in with concrete, making the chute be all at sidewalk-level.
This still does not make the chute into an acceptable trail, but it is better than the status quo, and relatively easy to do, until the better alternatives can be performed.
You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Click here to login.